Wikipedia:Help desk Information

From Wikipedia
The Wikipedia help desk is a place where you can ask questions about how to use or edit Wikipedia. For other types of questions, use the search box or the reference desk.
  • For other types of questions, see Help:Contents and Are you in the right place? If you have comments about a specific article, use that article's talk page.
  • Do not provide your email address or any other contact information. Answers will be provided on this page only.
  • We are all volunteers, so sometimes replies can take some time. Please be patient. Check back on this page to see if your question has been answered.
  • If you need real-time help, you can join our IRC help channel, #wikipedia-en-help.
  • If you are a new editor, you might prefer to ask your question at the Teahouse, an area specifically for new users to get help with editing, article creation and general Wikipedia use, in a friendly environment.
  • Remember to sign your post by adding 4 tildes (~~~~) at the end of your post. Alternatively, you can click on the signature icon ( OOjs UI icon signature-ltr.svg) on the edit toolbar.

November 30 Information

Is there a way to see the most viewed new created articles of the last week?

I want to keep an overview of the huge amout of new articles. Petscan crashes when I try. Any suggsettions? -- Noobius2 ( talk) 01:49, 30 November 2021 (UTC)

It's an indirect method, Noobius2 but the criteria for "did you know..." mean that many interesting new articles get nominated to appear on the Main page, and when they do (after a couple of weeks, usually) there is a large spike in views which will dominate their stats. You can look up former DYK in the archive at WP:DYKA. Mike Turnbull ( talk) 11:17, 1 December 2021 (UTC)

NOlympics LA

I am not sure if NOlympics LA should have their separate article or not? SpinnerLaserzthe2nd ( talk) 04:01, 30 November 2021 (UTC)

@ SpinnerLaserzthe2nd: Hi there! Talk:NOlympics LA is the best place to discuss this, so I'm glad you've already posted there. Happy editing! GoingBatty ( talk) 04:59, 30 November 2021 (UTC)
@ GoingBatty: Don't forget the grammar too. I almost forgot, at the time when the article was new I did added sources to back it up. SpinnerLaserzthe2nd ( talk) 05:03, 30 November 2021 (UTC)
@ SpinnerLaserzthe2nd: I see you made some grammar changes which were reverted. Per the Wikipedia:BOLD, revert, discuss cycle, your best bet would be to create a new discussion on the article's talk page that just focuses on your concerns and suggestions about the grammar. However, the grammar is moot if the article shouldn't exist. GoingBatty ( talk) 05:31, 30 November 2021 (UTC)
@ GoingBatty: Okay. I also said that "I do not condone [or] support this organization because of the organizations they partnered" and the reason why I said this is because I added a source that partnered with the Anti Racist Action (which is a violent far-left group) and in this edit. I tried to make accurate edits as I could but it failed. Well, you can see the talk page for yourself. I want to make an unbiased version of my edit that was removed but I do not know how because when it comes to editing political articles, things can get ugly for me. SpinnerLaserzthe2nd ( talk) 06:14, 30 November 2021 (UTC)
Almost confused this with WP:NOLYMPICS. Best Wishes, Lee Vilenski ( talkcontribs) 15:04, 30 November 2021 (UTC)


New article written but is seems to have gone to a "profile" and there's no way to submit it.... WAY TOO COMPLICATED.

Any ideas? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Drednm ( talkcontribs) 12:16, 30 November 2021 (UTC)

Drednm I will move the draft to the draft space and add the information so you can submit it(it is provided if you create a draft via WP:AFC). 331dot ( talk) 12:19, 30 November 2021 (UTC)
It is now at Edward Lorusso. 331dot ( talk) 12:22, 30 November 2021 (UTC)
Hello, Drednm. Please read Your first article. Writing a Wikipedia article begins with finding several reliable sources which are independent of the subject and contain significant coverage of the subject - not blogs, wikis, forums, social media, or anything written, published, or with major input from the subject or their associates. If you do not start with several such sources then you are building a house with no foundations, and it may well fall down, wasting all your work. -- ColinFine ( talk) 12:38, 30 November 2021 (UTC)
Another thing which you should do before you submit the draft for review is to ensure that you provide properly cited references, see Help:referencing for beginners, so that readers can see which parts of the text are supported by which references. -- David Biddulph ( talk) 13:08, 30 November 2021 (UTC)
As it stands now, that draft is not getting accepted. Based on my quick look around, it doesn't appear the subject satisfies WP:BIO. Clarityfiend ( talk) 14:34, 30 November 2021 (UTC)

Citing Sources

I would like to know how to cite sources for an article. I went to the beginners section, only to find more questions than answers.

Thank you in advance. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Hangane ( talkcontribs) 18:43, 30 November 2021 (UTC)

You'll find advice at Help:Referencing for beginners, & also see WP:Reliable sources. -- David Biddulph ( talk) 18:45, 30 November 2021 (UTC)
@ Hangane: Hi there! You might also enjoy watching the video at WP:EASYREFBEGIN. Happy editing! (Please remember to sign your posts on talk pages by typing four keyboard tildes like this: ~~~~.) GoingBatty ( talk) 04:36, 3 December 2021 (UTC)

Most appropriate title for a building article

I’m going to do a new article on a house in Birmingham. The house is called “The Homestead, 25 Woodbourne Road”. My question is whether that would be the best title, or rather, “The Homestead, 25 Woodbourne Road, Edgbaston”, along the lines of 21 Yateley Road, Edgbaston? We already have a number of “ Homestead” articles, including two on historic houses. My instinct says that it would help the reader if the title had more detail, i.e. Edgbaston, but I appreciate that many readers won’t have a clue where Edgbaston is. The Historic England listing calls it “The Homestead, 25 Woodbourne Road, B17” but I don’t think part of the postcode is very useful? Any advice greatly appreciated. KJP1 ( talk) 21:35, 30 November 2021 (UTC)

Hello, KJP1. The relevant policy is disambiguation: we use a term in parenthesis in an article title only to distinguish the subject from others with the same name, not to give additional information. So the title should probably be The Homestead, Edgbaston. -- ColinFine ( talk) 22:52, 30 November 2021 (UTC)
ColinFine - Many thanks indeed. The Homestead, Edgbaston it is. KJP1 ( talk) 06:24, 1 December 2021 (UTC)

Win total of college football coach Brian Kelly

I have recently contributed this edit to the LSU Tigers football page to add a reference and use a more encyclopedic tone. The previous contributor had referenced Brian Kelly as the winningest coach in Notre Dame history. The source I referenced for the hiring also makes this claim, but it takes into account 21 wins that were vacated by the NCAA. I had attempted to reference other pages to attempt to determine the standard on referring to his win total, but I've found some existing inconsistencies and I'm unsure what the "correct" answer should be. I have removed reference to his win total and the "winningest Notre Dame coach" claim from the LSU Tigers Football article for the time being to be safe.

Brian Kelly's page lists his record at Notre Dame as 92-39, which does not account for his vacated wins. This would be behind the win totals of previous Notre Dame coaches Knute Rockne, Lou Holtz, and Ara Parseghian. The article for the 2021 Notre Dame Fighting Irish football team and the ESPN article referenced above both use the figure of 113-40, which includes the vacated wins, and oddly enough, an extra loss (I think Kelly's page isn't counting his loss in the 2013 national championship), but both still name him the winningest HC in Notre Dame history. However, the List of Notre Dame Fighting Irish head football coaches article has an entirely different figure of 106-39, placing him one win above Rockne. I'm not certain where the 106 is coming from, but I think it might be counting his vacated wins while missing some wins from the current 2021 season.

What should be the correct figure in this instance? My gut says that the correct total should be 92-40, and we shouldn't refer to him as the winningest ND coach of all time, but given the different figures used across multiple articles, plus a major external source giving him that distinction, I'm not sure, so I wanted to check on it. Has an established standard been determined for this somewhere? Jedibob5 ( talk) 21:39, 30 November 2021 (UTC)

First off, you're in the wrong place. This is for technical questions. You should be asking this at the Entertainment reference desk. In any case, lots of reliable sources say he's the winningest ND coach -, CBS, NBC, Sporting News, even Notre Dame - so he is as far as Wikipedia is concerned. His record currently stands at 113-40, according to Sports Reference and some of the aforementioned sources. Barry Bonds is still considered to have hit 762 homers, despite cheating his ass off. What can you do? Clarityfiend ( talk) 23:43, 30 November 2021 (UTC)
Noted. WP:HELP's description of this page didn't specifically mention that it was for technical issues, so I incorrectly assumed the scope of this page was broader than it is. I didn't use the reference desk initially since I considered this more of a policy question over a factual one (his win/loss totals and vacated games are known, I was more looking for an established precedent on how WP treats vacated results). Looking closer, perhaps the Village Pump may have also been a place to ask this. On the Bonds note, the MLB never actually vacated any of his statistics in the official record books, so even from an "official" standpoint he still holds the home run record. Kelly is de facto the winningest ND coach, but in the official NCAA record books he only has 92 wins, so that claim could be considered factually incorrect even if other sources disregard the vacated wins when referring to it. Jedibob5 ( talk) 17:21, 1 December 2021 (UTC)
What you could do is add that his total includes vacated wins. Clarityfiend ( talk) 23:47, 30 November 2021 (UTC)

December 1 Information

Edit time zones

I have a tradition that I make at least one Wikipedia edit every month, yet issues with that have come to a head due to time zones, in particular in April and November of this year, the former when I had accidentally forgotten that Wikipedia uses UTC for its main timekeeping and made an edit well after 7:59 Eastern Time for that month, and the latter when even though it was submitted at 6:59 Eastern Time, Wikipedia apparently disagreed and shifted it over a minute. The latter in particular honestly devastates me, as for me the impact of an error is not in its seriousness, but in its permanence—what chance do I have trying to convince a massive organization with tons of critical code to admit that I had not failed, that "yes, we incorrectly logged the time of submission for this edit" and change it accordingly? So, I have 2 questions, of wildly different difficulty:

  1. How would I change how edit times are displayed on my end, for the Watchlist, Contributions, Page Histories, and Edit Count?
  2. Hypothetically, what would I have to do in order to actually change the logged date and time for an edit? What rank and/or position would I have to get into?

Thanks. Grant Exploit ( talk) 01:00, 1 December 2021 (UTC)

@ Grant Exploit: You can set the time zone at Special:Preferences#mw-prefsection-rendering. This affects the displayed time here at but not in signatures and other times saved in wikitext. is an external tool. I don't think it has any time zone settings. There may be some Wikimedia developers with direct database access who could theoretically change Wikipedia time stamps but I have never heard of doing it and cannot imagine circumstances where it would be approved. There is no user group for editors which enables anything like that. PrimeHunter ( talk) 03:22, 1 December 2021 (UTC)


I have always contributed to Wikipedia. But I have seen such a leftest slant and incorrect information contrary to the conservative perspective. Wikipedia has become another Yahoo or Face Book. Be neutral and I would be glad to contribute. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2603:8001:BC41:7C00:6D52:7958:546D:36F8 ( talk) 01:38, 1 December 2021 (UTC)

It is difficult to respond to a general statement. If you have specific suggestions for possible changes to articles, please offer them. Wikipedia summarizes what independent reliable sources state, but does not provide equal time to all points of view. Wikipedia attempts to cover points of view in proportion to how sources cover them. If you only want to read about conservative points of view, this isn't the place for you. 331dot ( talk) 01:54, 1 December 2021 (UTC)
Thank you for your contributions, which are much appreciated. Please be aware that all contributions go to the Wikimedia Foundation, which among other things provides the server hardware and network facilities on which all Wikipedia language projects run. All Wikipedia projects are staffed and edited by volunteers who don't get paid at all. One of the main principles of Wikipedia is that all articles should maintain a balanced Neutral Point of View, not leaning to any particular place on the political spectrum. As 331dot says above, it depends on a variety of reliable sources which report events. Wikipedia is not the place for one-sided political debate. MinorProphet ( talk) 07:02, 3 December 2021 (UTC)

Adding map thumbnail using external link

Copied and pasted what was advertised as the appropriate syntax from Help:Pictures#Links; replaced file name and external link with correct parameters for the image I want, by carefully copying and pasting from the external site; hit "Preview"; and got a maddening little line of red text, as you can see. No pic.

Appomattox River Basin

(At least it did enclose the red text in a neat little box and place it on the lefthand side of the screen as I requested.) I tried various syntax combos copied and appropriately modified from other articles; similar results. I tested the original sample text and it worked like a charm. What's up? Incompatible file type? Some quirk of the site that I'm trying to get it to retrieve the image from? Wikipedia code doesn't like me? (National Weather Service content is in the public domain, BTW.) -- 2603:6081:8004:DD5:6451:2AC4:EB73:1BE ( talk) 03:18, 1 December 2021 (UTC)

You cannot cause Wikipedia to display an image by linking to an external site. Instead, you must upload the image as a file to Wikimedia Commons (strongly preferred if the copyright license is compatible like this one) or into English Wikipedia file repository if it is to be used under the "fair use" doctrine. You start the upload process by running the upload wizard by clicking on "Upload file" in the left-hand column or by clicking this link: Wikipedia:File Upload Wizard. - Arch dude ( talk) 03:59, 1 December 2021 (UTC)
It's worth noting that you need an account to upload images, you can't do it as an IP editor. ( talk) 09:08, 1 December 2021 (UTC)

Right, I did notice that I need an account to upload images. So that would be option (C), Wikipedia doesn't like me. OK, feeble attempt at humor aside...this still doesn't add up. What is the mechanism by which the sample code provided on the Help page does happen to show the requested picture? Belgium government portal The code would seem to be pulling the file from an external source; if not, then what is the point of the "link=" field? .................wait, never mind. Just realized that the flag image file shown here is not actually stored externally, but clicking on it takes the user to an external link, the one imbedded in the code. That is, "link=" creates a hyperlink under a picture; it's not, as I had erroneously assumed, a command to go fetch data.

But if that's the case, then the way the syntax works and doesn't work is not at all clear from any of the Help pages I looked at. Now that I've been enlightened, I see that technically the info is there and I can recognize it: "You may be looking for inline linking to external images. This is not allowed..." I noticed that disclaimer before, but somehow naively thought that "inline linking" didn't refer to what I was trying to do. Yes, a Wikilink is provided there for a Help page on that subject -- but that would have meant more reams of material for me to wade through trying to get a simple answer to a reasonably simple question.

Seems obvious now that I think about it. But I suggest, as humbly as I can, that something like the following needs to be repeatedly spelled out, in all the relevant Help sections:

"The link= field can be used to specify an external site to which the user will be taken upon clicking on the image...Note that link= is not used and cannot be used to 'fetch' an image stored on an external website...Wikipedia provides no way ever to 'pull in' an image from an external site, whether from within the text of an article or by using image-display syntax...Images must always be uploaded before they can be displayed, just as text must always be typed in before it can be displayed." -- 2603:6081:8004:DD5:6451:2AC4:EB73:1BE ( talk) 11:44, 1 December 2021 (UTC)

Hello, IP user. As you say, that message is there at the top of the section. But if you think more explanation would be helpful, you can edit Help:Pictures to add some! Alternatively, if you don't feel confident in doing that, you can make the suggestion on Help Talk:Pictures , or at the talk page of the Wikipedia:Help Project. -- ColinFine ( talk) 13:19, 1 December 2021 (UTC)

Donation prompts

Hi I'm wondering if anyone on your team has thought about selling some Wikipedia stuff instead of prompting people to donate? I think you could get £10 out of me for a mug but I wouldn't press the button to donate £2!

Kind of bizarre but just a thought.


Occasional User — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2A01:4C8:485:EFF1:296E:1C64:9ED9:3132 ( talk) 03:52, 1 December 2021 (UTC)

You could check out the Wikipedia Store. Proceeds from sales there go to the Wikimedia Foundation like donations do. I don't see any mugs for sale, unfortunately. clpo13( talk) 04:15, 1 December 2021 (UTC)
$18 for a "tumbler". It will keep your coffee warm for you. :) -- Bob drobbs ( talk) 04:18, 1 December 2021 (UTC)
Mug. Deor ( talk) 19:05, 2 December 2021 (UTC)
And, just to be clear since nobody else has mentioned it, both the asks for donations and the store are run by the Wikimedia Foundation, while the actual day-to-day of the encyclopedia is run by us lowly volunteers. We have no influence over these things. Beeblebrox ( talk) 06:02, 1 December 2021 (UTC)


Is the request for contributions genuine? I donated £5 earlier this year and yet I am led to believe that I last donated in 2016,one time I am told I will not be asked again then there is another request, what is going on? Is this a scam or a genuine request? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2A02:C7E:1205:ED00:C55A:1D53:BD0E:F1A8 ( talk) 08:45, 1 December 2021 (UTC)

As you have not created an account, the request for donations will be shown again, since Wikipedia has no way of knowing that you have already donated in the past. It is a genuine request for donations.

Have a great day, Splatana ( talk) 09:45, 1 December 2021 (UTC)

Please also read Wikimedia_Foundation#Finances.-- Shantavira| feed me 10:01, 1 December 2021 (UTC)

How do i make an article

Hi and Merry Early Christmas 🎄, How do i make an article? (This is not the same question from lastime) Lil Moon Teddy-- Lil Moon Teddy ( talk) 10:38, 1 December 2021 (UTC)

Lil Moon Teddy Creating a new article is challenging, and it's a good idea to both use the new user tutorial and to spend some time editing existing articles in areas that interest you, to get a feel for how Wikipedia operates and what is expected of article content.
If you still wish to create an article now, you should first make sure that the topic you want to write about meets the special Wikipedia definition of notability, either that broad one or one of the more specific topic based ones, such as notable musicians. Then gather at least three independent reliable sources with significant coverage of the topic to summarize, where the sources have decided on their own to cover the topic and not done so based on prompting by the topic or any materials put out by the topic(like a press release or basic announcement). You may then visit Articles for Creation to create a draft in which you summarize those sources and then submit it for review. This sounds very easy, but it is not. 331dot ( talk) 10:59, 1 December 2021 (UTC) ( Request to block him indefinitely.

Recently, similar documents in Nintendo 64, Korean Wikipedia, and English Wikipedia have damaged documents a lot, and there are many edits that delete the entire document.

Editing is similar to Korean Wikipedia, so we ask for indefinite blocking. Takuyakoz ( talk) 10:55, 1 December 2021 (UTC)

Takuyakoz Please tell about users who should be blocked at WP:AIV. 331dot ( talk) 11:00, 1 December 2021 (UTC)

Request for donations

I already make monthly payments to Wikipedia, so when you make a request, please add an 'already giving' tab — Preceding unsigned comment added by ( talk) 15:13, 1 December 2021 (UTC)

To quote @ Splatana, "the request for donations will be shown again, since Wikipedia has no way of knowing that you have already donated in the past." You could create an account, because it has preferences to disable the fundraising banners. Explodicator7331 ( talk) 15:47, 1 December 2021 (UTC)

cite error using note

Stillwater, Ossining I get the error message "Cite error: There are <ref group=Note> tags on this page, but the references will not show without a {{reflist|group=Note}} template (see the help page)." But the note and the refereences do seem to show ok, in spite of the error message. Part of my problem is that I am using visual editing, but the help information uses source editing notation, which I don't really understand. Androidpar ( talk) 16:08, 1 December 2021 (UTC)

References are automatically listed at the end if there is no reflist template and the only ones that won't show are the ones that have a group parameter (which in your case was a single incomplete reference). I think you probably accidentally inserted this so have removed it - the error has now been removed from the page. QuiteUnusual ( talk) 16:14, 1 December 2021 (UTC)



My name is Jed Kaplan, a Sports Investor and Wall Street Executive. How can I set up a Wikipedia Page for myself.

Thanks — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2601:581:4503:7310:ED4F:733:EEB9:143A ( talk) 16:11, 1 December 2021 (UTC)

Hello, Jed. The simple answer is that you don't. If you meet Wikipedia's criteria for notability, then there could be an article (not just a "page") about you. The article will not belong to you, will not be for your benefit, will not be controlled by you, should not be written by you (see WP:autobiography), will not necessarily say what you want it to say, and should be based almost entirely on what people wholly unconnected with you have chosen to publish about you, not on what you or your associates say or want to say. -- ColinFine ( talk) 16:22, 1 December 2021 (UTC)


Why do I keep getting interpreted while scrolling thru Wikipedia asking for funds when I donated $20 last year??? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2600:387:C:5610:0:0:0:6 ( talk) 16:55, 1 December 2021 (UTC)

Wikipedia has no way to know that the person sitting at your computer/holding the device at any given moment has seen a donation message or actually donated. If you want to avoid getting donation requests, you may create an account and suppress the donation requests in the account preferences. 331dot ( talk) 16:59, 1 December 2021 (UTC)
If you want to stop seeing fundraising banners, you can go to this page on each of your devices to suppress the banners. Or, you can create an account, navigate to this page and untick the “Fundraising” check box. GMX🎄 (on the go!) 17:01, 1 December 2021 (UTC)

Recent Edit to Serol

Hi Serol, I am Sherif Meleka, this page is about me and my publications. My name is spelled Sherif Meleka not Sharif Malikah. People who know me or those who want to search my work would not find my page if my name is not spelled the correct way. Please use the correct spelling for my first and last names. In the Arabic version my name is properly spelled شريف مليكة. — Preceding unsigned comment added by SherifMeleka ( talkcontribs) 19:52, 1 December 2021 (UTC)

Hello SherifMeleka, I suppose it is the article Sharif Malikah. Please note Wikipedia:Article_titles#Use_commonly_recognizable_names and please use sources. Regards -- Serols ( talk) 19:56, 1 December 2021 (UTC)
This looks like a case of variant Romanisation rather than an intentional misspelling. — A little blue Bori v^_^v Jéské Couriano 23:06, 1 December 2021 (UTC)

Tried editing and got blocked…

I tried editing a actress. I can’t remember her name but she acted in an episode of Electric Dreams an Amazon Prime original. I typed in her name, the episode she starred in and the year. After I tried submitting Wikipedia said I was blocked with no explanation. I may be more inclined to donate if Wikipedia was more user friendly in that way. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2603:8080:B603:C29E:9512:BAA0:57B1:A2A4 ( talk) 22:58, 1 December 2021 (UTC)

Would you like to tell us the name of the actress so we can try to trace what happened? ClaudineChionh ( talkcontribs) 23:49, 1 December 2021 (UTC)
Please provide the name of your blocked account, so that we can see what happened. RudolfRed ( talk) 00:00, 2 December 2021 (UTC)
IP, my guess is that you were using a dynamic internet address and the address you were allocated had been blocked because of problems with a previous user. I can sympathise with the inconvenience as I sometimes have the same problem. Your current IP is evidently not blocked. TSventon ( talk) 00:03, 2 December 2021 (UTC)

Douglas County Historic LANDMARK list

National Register of Historic Places listings in Douglas County, Colorado

Isn't this the wikipedia place where Franktown Cemetery should be

there is a huge cross in the middle of the cemetery that states Douglas County Historic LANDMARK in 2006 Franktown Cemetery 1870...

I live close and have 1000s of photos including the CROSS

please if you could add this to the list

and then I can also go to the Bayou Gulch and take photos and upload

Thank you so much for your assistance with this update.

Carole Taylor DAR Historic Pres. Chair — Preceding unsigned comment added by ( talk) 23:32, 1 December 2021 (UTC)

Franktown Cemetery is not listed on the website of the National Register of Historic Places. Being a Douglas County Historic Landmark is apparently not the same thing as being on the national register. We do apparently have an article on Bayou Gulch which could use a nice picture. Wikignome Wintergreen talk 03:59, 2 December 2021 (UTC)

December 2 Information

How do I find which article is featured in the most languages?

Per above, how do I find out which Wikipedia article is a featured article in the most languages? Tyrone Madera ( talk) 00:12, 2 December 2021 (UTC)

By guesswork, it could be United States of America, which has 300 languages. There must be a better way. TSventon ( talk) 00:32, 2 December 2021 (UTC)
USA is not a Featured article. SandyGeorgia ( Talk) 00:42, 2 December 2021 (UTC)
It's not featured in English, but it is in Lithuanian and some other languages. Tyrone Madera ( talk) 00:54, 2 December 2021 (UTC)
[Edit Conflict] It doesn't usually work as you imagine, Tyrone Madera: "we" (the several hundred thousand completely independent volunteer editors) don't usually write an article in one language and then translate it into all the others. Instead, the various different-language Wikipedias operate almost completely independently from one another and most of the articles in any one of them were written from scratch in that language. Consequently, any two different-language articles about the same subject will probably be significantly different in the references they are based on, their structure, some of their factual (or supposedly factual) content, and even their titles: they cannot therefore really be considered as the "same" article.
Sometimes someone will use a translation from "Language-A Wikipedia" into "Language-B" as a starting point for an "L-B Wikipedia" article, but because each Wikipedia's standards and protocols (such as how many and what sort of references are considered necessary and acceptable) have been formulated and evolved separately, they may differ significantly, so again the resulting articles in "L-A W" and L-B W" will not really be the same article. {The poster foremerly known as} ( talk) 00:53, 2 December 2021 (UTC)
That's good to know, but regardless of the differences between articles, I'm curious to find out—using shared wikidata identifiers as a baseline—which articles have been "featured" the most times in different languages, as indicated by the stars that shows up next to each article's interlanguage sidebar links. Tyrone Madera ( talk) 01:01, 2 December 2021 (UTC)
Wikipedia:Wikipedia records#Languages has an unsourced claim:
  • Featured article on the most different language Wikipedias: Solar System (22 languages)
PrimeHunter ( talk) 02:10, 2 December 2021 (UTC)
At Solar System (Q544), I count 23. Don't know whether that's actually the most, though. Rummskartoffel 11:22, 2 December 2021 (UTC)
OK, I ran this query, which is a pre-made example, to get all FAs, downloaded the result as JSON (verbose version), and then used the following code in Node.js to find everything with at least 20 FAs (there's probably a way to do it in SPARQL directly, but I don't know it):
require("./query.json") => b.item.value)
  .sort((a, b) => parseInt(a.split("Q")[1]) - parseInt(b.split("Q")[1]))
  .map(v => ({ v, n: 1 }))
    (acc, x) =>
      acc[acc.length - 1] && acc[acc.length -1].v === x.v
        ? ((acc[acc.length - 1].n += x.n), acc)
        : acc.concat([x]),
  .sort((a, b) => b.n - a.n)
  .filter(x => x.n >= 20)

I've found Mars (Q111) with 29, Earth (Q2) with 26, Solar System (Q544) with 23, World War II (Q362) with 22, United States of America (Q30) with 21, Germany (Q183) with 20, and Moon (Q405) with 20. Rummskartoffel 17:16, 2 December 2021 (UTC)
That's so cool! Thank you! Tyrone Madera ( talk) 02:25, 3 December 2021 (UTC)

My edits don't show up

I'm trying to do a simple editing to the Dennis Rader page. I click "submit" changes and all looks well. But once I refresh the page, my changes aren't there anymore. Why? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2804:14C:6583:622C:246C:CFB:2E19:DB0 ( talk) 00:21, 2 December 2021 (UTC)

Try refreshing your browser's cache with Ctrl + F5. Ixfd64 ( talk) 00:23, 2 December 2021 (UTC)
Officer Tenpenny needs to spend some time away from terrorising schoolkids to get to your edit. The article is CRASHlocked. — A little blue Bori v^_^v Jéské Couriano 00:24, 2 December 2021 (UTC)
Symbol redirect vote2.svg Courtesy link:  Dennis Rader
Your edit about the song by Exodus is visible to me. Is something else missing? ClaudineChionh ( talkcontribs) 00:25, 2 December 2021 (UTC)
Yes - the article is CRASHlocked and his edit's awaiting review last I saw. — A little blue Bori v^_^v Jéské Couriano 00:28, 2 December 2021 (UTC)
I've accepted the edit and dropped them a welcome template. It's probably not a great idea to use weird jargon you made up yourself in responses to help requests. Beeblebrox ( talk) 01:24, 2 December 2021 (UTC)
You should know full and goddamn well abut my use of that phrase by now.A little blue Bori v^_^v Jéské Couriano 02:13, 2 December 2021 (UTC)
Chalk me up as still confused. I apparently slept through this bit of wikidrama. clpo13( talk) 06:08, 2 December 2021 (UTC)
"14 months for a six-month trial" should answer it. — A little blue Bori v^_^v Jéské Couriano 19:52, 2 December 2021 (UTC)
This is the help desk, not the "make a point with gibberish the person asking for help won't know about" desk. Beeblebrox ( talk) 06:22, 2 December 2021 (UTC)
I'm also not sure if there's some kind of inside joke that I'm missing here. I've never heard of CRASHlocked, and neither of the piped links the namedropping editor posted contain the word. Without more context this looks just plain rude, and out of place on a very visible, volunteer help desk by someone who has otherwise been making helpful edits. TimTempleton (talk) (cont) 08:18, 2 December 2021 (UTC)
I concur. Jéské Couriano has three times used incomprehensible jargon in this thread. That isn't appropriate in a page that aims to help inexperienced users. Maproom ( talk) 08:52, 2 December 2021 (UTC)
I've never heard of the term before either and assumed it was an inside joke between editors. Ixfd64 ( talk) 18:43, 2 December 2021 (UTC)
A search of all namespaces [1] gets three hits including this, all by Jéské Couriano on a site with millions of pages. Officer Tenpenny is a video game character I also never heard about. Please don't use weird easter egg links when helping users. PrimeHunter ( talk) 19:41, 2 December 2021 (UTC)

What's the hatnote for warning the the subject of an article might not be notable?

Question as above. I have been hunting but I cannot find what it is. Thank you.-- A bit iffy ( talk) 03:13, 2 December 2021 (UTC)

@ A bit iffy: I think you are looking for {{ Notability}} RudolfRed ( talk) 03:25, 2 December 2021 (UTC)
Many thanks for that. -- A bit iffy ( talk) 03:28, 2 December 2021 (UTC)
@ A bit iffy: You also might want to take a look at Twinkle which both allows easy placement and has a list of templates that are curated by topic (see Wikipedia:Twinkle/doc#Tag). Regards So Why 13:42, 2 December 2021 (UTC)

How to hire a Freelancer to write an article and content for my company Wikipedia page

How to hire a Freelancer to write an article and content for my company Wikipedia page? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Biohazardplus ( talkcontribs) 06:23, 2 December 2021 (UTC)

@ Biohazardplus: You are strongly recommended not to, as both you and whomever you hire will be subject to restrictions imposed by the paid editor policy, such as being generally forbidden from directly editing the article. — Tenryuu 🐲 (  💬 •  📝 ) 06:25, 2 December 2021 (UTC)
Biohazardplus, there is no such thing as "my company page", for you or anybody else. If your company meets Wikipedia's criteria for notability, (roughly, that people wholly unconnected with your company have published enough material about it to base an article on) then there can be an article about your company. The article will not belong to the company, will not be for your company's benefit, will not be under the company's control, will not necessarily way what you want it to say, and should be based almost entirely on what people unconnected with you have published about your company, not on what you or your associates say or wish to say. You are strongly discouraged from creating such an article yourself. There are people who will take your money and purport to write an article for you. I imagine some of them are honest, and will give you no guarantees that they can create an article or that you will be pleased with the result; many of them are scam merchants.
Separately, I see you have been blocked for having a promotional username: you can change it, or more simply abandon it and create a personal account. But you will still not be permitted to try and use Wikipedia for promotion of any kind. -- ColinFine ( talk) 11:26, 2 December 2021 (UTC)

I want to become admin

What's the process to apply for becoming an administrator.? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Aqzswxdecfrvgtb ( talkcontribs) 07:37, 2 December 2021 (UTC)

@ Aqzswxdecfrvgtb: You would need to have edited without issues for several years making tens if not hundreds of thousands of edits including creating new content. You would to demonstrate thorough knowledge of Wikipedia's policies and that you can interact positively with other editors. You would also be required to show that you have a need for the additional tools that an Admin has access to. More information can be found at WP:RFA and the section 'About RFA' also has links to recently closed applications where you will find discussions about the applicants. As your account is only a few eeks old with 37 edits it would probably be best to continue to edit 'generally' for the time being. (Please remember to sign your posts on talk pages by typing four keyboard tildes like this: ~~~~.) Thank you. Eagleash ( talk) 08:04, 2 December 2021 (UTC)
Also, we wouldn't give administrator rights to a paid editor. Joseph 2302 ( talk) 09:02, 2 December 2021 (UTC)
Paid editors might run for adminship and conceivably succeed. However, no editor (paid or not) would succeed if they (1) do not know how to sign posts and (2) have been declined a draft two days ago with the rationale zero in depth coverage in reliable independent sources, this is just paid for promotion of a new non notable film fails WP:NFILM.. Tigraan Click here for my talk page ("private" contact) 11:29, 2 December 2021 (UTC)

Recreating Deleted Page

I just posted this on the talk page of another editor but it doesn't appear as though he's actively editing so thought I would seek advice here. I was going through the List of unicorn startup companies and am planning to create pages for those who don't have one. Snyk is on the list - their page was deleted in November 2017. From what I looked up, I believe 4 years later it's now notable enough to deserve its own page. The instruction said to first contact the user who performed the deletion. I did that but as I wrote, I'm not sure that he will see it. I have no idea what was on the original page and not sure it matters. Should I just go ahead and create the page? MaskedSinger ( talk) 09:45, 2 December 2021 (UTC)

@ MaskedSinger Welcome to Help Desk! That seems reasonable. You contacted Nyttend who doesn't appear to be active, neither is is their alternate Nyttend backup active either. If you want to see what the article was like before, you can request a WP:REFUND. Be prepared to share the top 3-4 links that establish WP:GNG, otherwise it will be challenged again. Happy editing and recreating. ~ 🦝 Shushugah (he/him •  talk) 14:14, 2 December 2021 (UTC)
@ Shushugah Thanks for getting back to me. To be honest, I don't think I need to see the old article. By definition, it's outdated and whatever was written then wasn't enough to satisfy notability. So my thinking is starting a page from scratch. Is this ok? Or do I have to start with the deleted page as a base? I've got no problem having to establish WP:GNG - if it's not there, the page doesn't deserve to be here. MaskedSinger ( talk) 14:20, 2 December 2021 (UTC)
@ MaskedSinger No go ahead! I agree that WP:REFUND in this case is likely not useful. The main situation where it's useful is if it was a comprehensive draft that was deleted, or likely to contain rare/hard to find sources, but since this is a modern topic, that's unlike. Go for it! ~ 🦝 Shushugah (he/him •  talk) 14:22, 2 December 2021 (UTC)
@ Shushugah Thank you for being super helpful!! A real pleasure to meet you :) MaskedSinger ( talk) 14:25, 2 December 2021 (UTC)
@ Shushugah If you would like to take a look. I just published it - Snyk MaskedSinger ( talk) 20:15, 2 December 2021 (UTC)

Elijah Brush. This is my great-great grandfather. He is shown on Mayors of Detroit BUT not in a list of Mayor's. Should be just under Sibley. Can someone assist. Thanks

Elijah Brush. This is my great-great grandfather. He is shown on Mayors of Detroit BUT not in a list of Mayor's. Should be just under Sibley. Can someone assist. Thanks — Preceding unsigned comment added by Zumabch ( talkcontribs) 11:50, 2 December 2021 (UTC)

@ Zumabch: The relevant talk page would be the best place to discuss and request this. ClaudineChionh ( talkcontribs) 11:57, 2 December 2021 (UTC)
@ Zumabch: Elijah Brush is listed after Sibley at List of mayors of Detroit#First incorporation. If you refer to List of mayors of Detroit#Early American leadership or List of mayors of Detroit#Second Board of Trustees then it's for chairmen of the Board of Trustees. Do you have a published reliable source that Elijah Brush held that position? If you refer to something else then please link it. If it's in List of mayors of Detroit then quote the section heading. PrimeHunter ( talk) 16:51, 2 December 2021 (UTC)

Infoboxes and location of images outside it

Hi there. One of the things I like most in working with Wikipedia is hunting for images and including them in an article. It makes the article more attractive and informative. However there seems to be a snag: I cannot always insert an image where I want it to go. This is especially annoying in articles with an infobox. The infobox doesn't tolerate any image in the text to its left. This sometimes results in huge blocks of text without illustrations (depending on the length of the infobox) and images not placed right next to the relevant text, but gathered way down under the infobox. Am I doing something wrong? Is there a solution for this?-- Judithcomm ( talk) 12:11, 2 December 2021 (UTC)

Be aware that you do not know what size of display someone might be using to read an article, which way it is orientated, nor what font size they may be using; all these affect the layout of a page. Some infoboxes will allow an image to be displayed in them. Bazza ( talk) 13:36, 2 December 2021 (UTC)
I'm aware of that, but that doesn't really answer my question. See Wyatt Earp for example.-- Judithcomm ( talk) 13:41, 2 December 2021 (UTC)
@ Judithcomm: I think that MOS:LEAD explains why things work this way. The lead part of an article usually has a single image, intended to let the reader know they have reached the correct page. The lead summarises, in text, the key points from the article and sits above the "contents" box. So the intention is that all the other pictures should be found within the sections below, in what is really the true "article". If leads were to include multiple images, then those images would need to be repeated later where they were more fully discussed and that would obviously be unnecessary duplication. Keep up the good work of adding relevant images! Mike Turnbull ( talk) 17:09, 2 December 2021 (UTC)
@ Judithcomm: Please always include an example from the beginning. Your example has the right-floating {{ O.K. Corral}} right after the infobox. You can use {{ stack}} around them to allow a left-floating image but note MOS:SANDWICH. It may look bad in narrow windows. PrimeHunter ( talk) 17:13, 2 December 2021 (UTC)
Thanks for all your input.-- Judithcomm ( talk) 03:56, 3 December 2021 (UTC)

Donations to Wikipedia

Why have I not received an email from you confirming my £20 donation made 1st December? I have donated on 2 occasions, but will not donate again if I do not receive confirmation of my payment. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2A00:23C8:6380:9001:E8BF:5051:84D4:7050 ( talk) 12:22, 2 December 2021 (UTC)

We do not have access to information on donations because these are actually made to the Wikimedia Foundation. See here for how to contact them. QuiteUnusual ( talk) 12:25, 2 December 2021 (UTC)
You might also be interested to read Wikimedia_Foundation#Finances.-- Shantavira| feed me 13:10, 2 December 2021 (UTC)


I made a $10 contribution a couple of days ago and I am still getting requests for a donation. How long will this go on? I also make a two dollar a month contribution that started last year. Will this continue without me doing anything? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Geetwo1940 ( talkcontribs) 14:13, 2 December 2021 (UTC)

If you want to turn off fundraising notifications, you can navigate to this section of your Preferences and untick the “Fundraising” checkbox. (Make sure to click the “Save” button at the bottom once you’ve unticked the box.) If you have questions about the campaign itself, you can read the donating FAQ. GMX🎄 (on the go!) 15:22, 2 December 2021 (UTC)

How to change the header ?

My Header is currently Chris McCoy I want it to say "Chris McCoy, Rock Keyboardist". How do I make this change ? It is greyed out in the visual editor.

Thanks, — Preceding unsigned comment added by Chrismccoymusic ( talkcontribs) 17:30, 2 December 2021 (UTC)

That requires a page move, would not be an acceptable title, and would get punted back to draft or deleted if you attempted to bypass the review process because it is woefully undersourced. We are not social media. We are an encyclopaedia project, and sources are required. — A little blue Bori v^_^v Jéské Couriano 17:37, 2 December 2021 (UTC)
Hello, Chrismccoymusic. Please read WP:your first article and WP:what Wikipedia is not. Also, your user name is not acceptable, as it appears to be a promotional name. You are welcome to change the name (or more easily, abandon the account and create a new one); but if your purpose here is to promote yourself rather than to improve the encyclopaedia but, then you will save yourself and everybody else much time and effort if you stop trying. -- ColinFine ( talk) 18:18, 2 December 2021 (UTC)
@ Chrismccoymusic: See also Wikipedia:Articles for creation/Scam warning. GoingBatty ( talk) 04:47, 3 December 2021 (UTC)

password reset

I forgot my password to get into my wikipedia account. I have tried to click the reset button like 3 times and no email has been sent so far and its been about an hour since I tried the first time. I was logged in on my phone and tried to figure out how to change my password from there but couldnt figure it out. Unfortunately, I needed to create this account for a class so I cant just abandon it — Preceding unsigned comment added by ( talk) 18:15, 2 December 2021 (UTC)

Hello. Have you checked your spam folder? Or have you changed your email address since you created the account? If the latter, then I'm afraid your account is irrecoverable. However, don't lose heart: you can indeed create a new account. I'm guessing that you were working in a user sandbox (otherwise there is no connection whatever between the account and whatever you were working on with it)? You can edit that sandbox from a different account.
So, suppose your old account is called "Myname". Then you can create a new account called, say "Myname new". It would be a good idea to create a user page for the new account, User:Myname new, and put a message on it that you are the same person as the lost account "Myname". If you were working on a sandbox under the old account, you can find it on User:Myname/sandbox. Or if you can't remember what you were working on, you can go to Special:contributions/Myname, and will give you a list of all edits you made with that account. (Of course you need to substitute the actual old and new account names in those links. -- ColinFine ( talk) 18:29, 2 December 2021 (UTC)

Tauqir Sharif

I published a draft this afternoon which had general references in it. The new page reviewer moved the page back to draft for the reason that it had general references in it (as well as inline citations). Although I don't believe that having general references in a stub article is wrong, I have removed them for the sake of argument and republished the page. Now the page says it was created by the reviewer who unpublished it instead of me. How can I correct this please? There is no need to move a page out of main space just because it has general references in it and a reviewer doesn't like that, it is no reason to un-publish the page, but what is done is done. Can these page reviewers not be given some training? The reason given on my talk page about why the page was unpublished was also totally inappropriate. Amirah talk 18:15, 2 December 2021 (UTC)

@ AmirahBreen: Tauqir Sharif has a different creator because it was created as a redirect when AngusWOOF moved the page to Tauqir Sharif. You should add your changes to the draft page instead and go through the Articles for Creation process. Published articles may be subject to deletion if the notability of the subject is challenged, while draft articles have more leeway in that regard and allow editors more time to establish notability. clpo13( talk) 18:33, 2 December 2021 (UTC)
There is no question of notability. There is more than enough reliable independent news coverage of his aid work, of his citizenship deprivation and also of his arrest, detention and torture by HTS for notability on all these. Amirah talk 18:37, 2 December 2021 (UTC)
Which three of the sources cited, in your opinion, do most to establish the subject as notable? Those based on interviews with the subject, his colleagues, and his family members, won't count, as they are not independent. Nor will those that mention his name and who he is, but lack in-depth discussion of him. Maproom ( talk) 18:44, 2 December 2021 (UTC)
AmirahBreen, you put multiple reference sections in that article. After those are removed, there are just a bunch of short statements saying he participated in some events, was one of either 700 people, 20 people or a handful of people in some flotilla event. It didn't explain how that person is individually notable. This is why I moved it to draft so that can be cleaned up. But now you undid the redirect and there are now two articles, one in mainspace Tauqir Sharif and Tauqir Sharif.
I recommend the draft be cultivated to rewrite and explain the bio in better detail and then with the abundance of references it should be able to be go back. But as it stands, the one in mainspace is a mess and is nowhere in any shape to be usable. AngusW🐶🐶F ( barksniff) 18:47, 2 December 2021 (UTC)
There is no reason why the draft should not be published as it stands now as a stub. Amirah talk 18:51, 2 December 2021 (UTC)
What you have said is untrue. Just because he participated in the flotilla event and that is in his background that doesn't detract from the fact that he is individually notable due to his aid work in Syria, his citizenship deprivation, his arrest, detention and torture by HTS, any one of these three sections would show notability even on it's own. These are things which you have conveniently ignored, in preferences for saying that in the flotilla events in his background he was part of a group of people. Amirah talk 19:01, 2 December 2021 (UTC)
As I have said above, notability is not about which sources are cited in the article. A subject if notable if sources exist, whether or not they are currently cited. Amirah talk 18:47, 2 December 2021 (UTC)
If you want three sources which are currently in the article I would say these three
but it is not about these three sources, it is the fact that the subject of this article is without doubt already notable and there should be no reason why the article couldn't be published in it's present state as a stub. Amirah talk 18:56, 2 December 2021 (UTC)
It needs to be explained better how he was involved in these events. I don't see him listed in List of participants of the Gaza flotilla, so which flotilla was he on? Road to Hope? You need to rewrite his biography and be more clear as to how he was involved. He was one of ~700 folks on the flotilla? He was on another flotilla? Same story with the imprisonments / kidnappings. What was he doing, how and for what reasons was he kidnapped, what was the negotiations that the groups did, and how was he released (voluntarily by group, or through some kind of deal, or escaped) What kind of aid work does he do? Move supplies? Provide medicine? Social work? Lead particular organisation branches or overall organisations? Again, this is why I suggest fleshing it out in draft. The references can support it afterwards. AngusW🐶🐶F ( barksniff) 19:07, 2 December 2021 (UTC)
This article is a stub. I see no reason why it should not be published as a stub. Yes, those things can be expanded upon either before or after the article is published. Please tell me why this article cannot be published now as a stub? Amirah talk 19:24, 2 December 2021 (UTC)
@ Theroadislong: who is also scrubbing the draft. AngusW🐶🐶F ( barksniff) 19:12, 2 December 2021 (UTC)
Our edits to improve the layout per WP:MOS were all reverted. Theroadislong ( talk) 19:51, 2 December 2021 (UTC)
Please explain your edits on the draft talk page. How and why are they per WP:MOS. If it is true that they are then you cannot expect any editor to improve simply by running roughshod over their work. Amirah talk 19:57, 2 December 2021 (UTC)
We are all volunteers here. The objective of Theroadislong and others is to improve the draft enough to make it acceptable as an article; they have no duty to explain in detail why each edit is an improvement. If you want to improve your editing skills, read WP:MOS and WP:N. As for the three sources you list above as best establishing the subject's notability: the first is based on statements by members of his family, and so not independent; the second establishes that the UK government has revoked his UK citizenship, but such revocation is, sadly, not unusual and does not make the victim notable; the third is a duplicate of the first. If you want to establish that he's notable, you'll need to find better sources than those. Simply writing "the subject of this article is without doubt already notable" won't convince anyone; we need evidence. Maproom ( talk) 08:34, 3 December 2021 (UTC)
However this reference does, in my opinion, count towards establishing notability. Maproom ( talk) 14:26, 3 December 2021 (UTC)

Blocking or muting a user

How do I mute/block a user on Wikipedia? TheAlienMan2002 ( talk) 21:55, 2 December 2021 (UTC)

Wikipedia is not a social media site. We don't have any provisions for "blocking" or "muting" other editors. -- Orange Mike | Talk 21:59, 2 December 2021 (UTC)
@ TheAlienMan2002: You can mute mentions (also called pings) from certain users in the notification tab of your user preferences or disable mentions entirely (see mw:Help:Notifications for details). However, there's no way to prevent a particular user from leaving messages on your talk page or to block them from interacting with you elsewhere on the site. clpo13( talk) 22:03, 2 December 2021 (UTC)
Not a technical way to. You can demand a given user no longer post on your talk page, and if they refuse to heed it an admin can block them for it. — A little blue Bori v^_^v Jéské Couriano 22:05, 2 December 2021 (UTC)
I don't think an admin would block someone for violating an unofficial interaction ban laid out by a brand new editor for no reason at all, especially since the only person to have contacted TheAlienMan2002 was warning them about their article edits, all three of which appear to be vandalism. ( talk) 22:41, 2 December 2021 (UTC)

It would really help with the vandalism on talk pages, but thanks. TheAlienMan2002 ( talk) 00:32, 3 December 2021 (UTC)

wiki — Preceding unsigned comment added by ( talk) 22:24, 2 December 2021 (UTC)

Hi. What is your question? RudolfRed ( talk) 22:32, 2 December 2021 (UTC)

Non-existing articles for deletion are added to my wachlist.

I have been noticing that entries like Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Frans Deckers are being added to my watchlist, even though no such page exists, and I did not watchlist that page myself. It seems to happen when I add projects to a talk page with Rater and then select a watchlist time period that is not permanent for the article after closing Rater. Has anyone noticed something similar? Vexations ( talk) 22:54, 2 December 2021 (UTC)

December 3 Information

Change my display to single column for ref

Pardon, probably an unusual question, and could not think how to search for an answer. Is there a simple means to stop ref lists displaying as multiple columns in pages I'm reading, as a personal preference I mean? ~ cygnis insignis 01:49, 3 December 2021 (UTC)

@ Cygnis insignis: I don't know how to formally disable reference columns but you can make the columns wider than the window to give the same effect. The lines should still wrap within the window. Try this in your CSS:
.mw-references-columns {column-width: 300em !important;}
PrimeHunter ( talk) 02:12, 3 December 2021 (UTC)
Greatly appreciated (it annoys me to be scrolling up and down as I scan through a list). ~ cygnis insignis 02:47, 3 December 2021 (UTC)

Citing a digital plant identification key

Hi, I'm wondering how I should cite Australian Rainforest Plants (Rockhamption to Victoria), which is an identification key that is only available by purchasing either a USB or an iPhone app. There doesn't seem to be a citation template specifically for this type of media — should I use the book template? It is, after all, a publication just like a book except that it's digital. —   Junglenut |  talk  03:55, 3 December 2021 (UTC)

A couple of things. For one, it appears to be a wp:self published source, which may not necessarily meet certain criteria for citing. Nevertheless, Gwen Harden and John Beaumont Williams are known botanists. You could use {{ cite ebook}} for accuracy, although that redirects to {{ cite book}}. The url is to a commercial site, and it might be best not to include it. An internet search for the title below brings it up at the top of the hits anyway. Couldn't find an ISBN. How about this (with url)?
{{cite ebook |title=Rainforest Plants of Australia: Rockhampton to southern Victoria (Digital Identification Key) |last1=Harden |first1=Gwen |author1-link=Gwen Harden |last2=and the rest |others= (E-book, available only on USB or mobile app) |date=2014 |url=}}
  • Harden, Gwen; and the rest (2014). Rainforest Plants of Australia: Rockhampton to southern Victoria (Digital Identification Key). (E-book, available only on USB or mobile app).
I'm sure there will be other approaches. MinorProphet ( talk) 08:21, 3 December 2021 (UTC)
@ MinorProphet: Thanks for those thoughts. According to {{ cite book}} the url parameter should only be used "where the text of the publication named by title can be found", so I won't use that. This key is the reimagined product of earlier physical publications by Harden, McDonald and Williams (all verified Australian botanists) so I'll prioritise them in the citations. This is how I'm thinking it should be done:
{{cite ebook |last1=Harden |first1=Gwen |author-link1=Gwen Harden |last2=Williams |first2=John |author-link2=John Beaumont Williams |last4=Nicholson |last3=McDonald |first3=Bill |first4=Hugh |last5=Nicholson |first5=Nan |last6=Tame |first6=Terry |display-authors=3 |date=2014 |title=Rainforest Plants of Australia: Rockhampton to Victoria |publisher=Gwen Harden Publishing |publication-place=Nambucca Heads, NSW |others=(Digital identification key, published as USB and mobile app)}}
  • Harden, Gwen; Williams, John; McDonald, Bill; et al. (2014). Rainforest Plants of Australia: Rockhampton to Victoria. (Digital identification key, published as USB and mobile app). Nambucca Heads, NSW: Gwen Harden Publishing.
How does that look to you? —   Junglenut |  talk  11:16, 3 December 2021 (UTC)
@ Junglenut: Looks pretty good to me. I've never quite understood the point of |display-authors= since it completely hides (except when editing) the remaining authors who you have spent time adding to the cite. If 'et al' could be made to appear in a {{ sfn}} but all the authors were shown in in the full {{ cite}} in the bibliography, that might make sense: but it doesn't do that. Template:Citation#Display_options isn't particularly forthcoming either. Maybe I'm missing something - perhaps it has to do with meta-data. MinorProphet ( talk) 12:13, 3 December 2021 (UTC)
If 'et al' could be made to appear in a {{ sfn}} but all the authors were shown in in the full {{ cite}} in the bibliography, that might make sense: but it doesn't do that.
That is just not true. Here is a contrived citation with a bunch of colors for names and the attendant short-form citation ({{ harvnb}} use here in lieu of {{ sfn}} for simplicity):
First the short form:
{{harvnb|Black|Brown|Red|Orange|2021}}Black et al. 2021
and the target citation:
{{cite book |title=Title |date=2021 |last=Black |last2=Brown |last3=Red |last4=Orange |last5=Yellow |last6=Gray |last7=Blue |last8=Violet |last9=Green |last10=White}}
Black; Brown; Red; Orange; Yellow; Gray; Blue; Violet; Green; White (2021). Title.
Trappist the monk ( talk) 13:11, 3 December 2021 (UTC)
Do not abuse parameters. |last2= holds the name of a single author; may include given and surnames but never for more than one author. Use |display-authors= to note that some author names have been omitted from the template or that that some author names in the template are not displayed in the rendered citation. |others= holds the names of 'other' contributors to the source who do not fit in |author=, |contributor=, |editor=, |interviewer=, |translator=.
Where is the 'Digital identification key' in the citation? How is a reader supposed to know which of the '1139 species' (or whatever) it is that you are citing? Always be specific with this and any other citation; don't make an interested reader search through a 500 page book to find the one page where the cited fact is located; provide the page number. For your example citation, name the species and provide a url or some other sort of in-source locator. If the url links to something that is behind a paywall, add |url-access=subscription. Because this source is more like an encyclopedia than a book, consider rewriting using {{ cite encyclopedia}}:
{{cite encyclopedia |last1=Harden |first1=Gwen |author-link1=Gwen Harden |last2=Williams |first2=John |author-link2=John Beaumont Williams |last4=Nicholson |last3=McDonald |first3=Bill |first4=Hugh |last5=Nicholson |first5=Nan |last6=Tame |first6=Terry |display-authors=3 |date=2014 |entry=''Syzygium luehmannii'' |title=Rainforest Plants of Australia: Rockhampton to Victoria |url= |url-access=subscription |publisher=Gwen Harden Publishing |location=Nambucca Heads, NSW}} – Digital identification key, published as USB and mobile app
Harden, Gwen; Williams, John; McDonald, Bill; et al. (2014). "Syzygium luehmannii". Rainforest Plants of Australia: Rockhampton to Victoria. Nambucca Heads, NSW: Gwen Harden Publishing. – Digital identification key, published as USB and mobile app
Trappist the monk ( talk) 13:11, 3 December 2021 (UTC)
Thanks very much for your most helpful and concise post, Trappist. 1.) It was certainly not my intention to abuse |last2=, I was merely being terminally lazy and hoping that the OP would realise that all the other authors needed specifying in the proper way. I think I was correct in this. 2.) I also wondered whether there were page numbers in the source, or how to find any particular entry - Junglenut didn't specify one - your example using {cite encyclopedia} is an admirable alternative. 3.) Thank you for clearing up some of my confusion about 'et al'. That's much like what I was hoping for. The last time I tried this (about 5 years ago) I couldn't get it to work with {sfn}s, and have never bothered since. I should have. Nevertheless, see below. 4.) The phrase "Digital identification key" appeared in the OP's section heading. The linked page [2] calls it an "Interactive Identification Key", but it seems to be a descriptive term rather than part of the work's official title. Sorry. 4.) I have always used |url-access=subscription for sites such as The Times paywall, where the entire news website (ie |url= is effectively blocked unless you shell out. I also wondered hard about this. The link that Junglenut provided is not such a page, nor does the specific url hide behind a paywall - it's more like any standard commercial site selling things, and you have to pay for the particular work in question, just like eg Amazon. I really have no desire to enter into minute discussions over this, I accept your knowledge and expertise. As I said in my initial reply, I think the url is unnecessary. Thanks again for your careful comments and demonstrating the correct use of certain parameters. However:
-- MinorProphet ( talk) 20:22, 3 December 2021 (UTC)
I think that on this help page, being terminally lazy and hoping that the OP would realise that all the other authors needed specifying in the proper way is not a good idea. Answers here should be scrupulously correct because the answers that we give are read by newbies who will take what we've written as the gospel truth.
Trappist the monk ( talk) 22:39, 3 December 2021 (UTC)

If I had come randomly across this particular problem without prompting, I think I would have done it as follows - following the order of authors etc. listed on the website. Sorry for the vertical layout in the raw text, I find it much easier to get |authorX-last= right...

{{cite book |last=Harden |first=Gwen |author-link=Gwen Harden |last2=McDonald |first2=Bill |last3=Nicholson |first3=Nan |last4=Tame |first4=Terry |last5=Williams |first5=John |author-link5=John Beaumont Williams |chapter=Syzygium luehmannii |title=Rainforest Plants of Australia: Rockhampton to Victoria |others=Photographs by Hugh Nicholson |date=2014 |publisher=Gwen Harden Publishing |location=Nambucca Heads, NSW}} – Interactive identification key, published as USB and mobile app

But {{sfn|Harden|McDonald|Nicholson|Tame|Williams|2014|loc=''Syzygium luehmannii''}} results in [1] with a warning (probably trivial and not an error as such although it looks like one), because Template:sfn#Large number of authors "Only the first four authors are required by the template. Listing more is not supported."

{{ harvnb}} similarly also only supports 4 authors, and more become 'et al' Template:Harvard citation no brackets#Large number of authors "Only the first four authors are required by the template. Listing more is not supported."

But {{harvnb|Harden|McDonald|Nicholson|Tame|Williams|2014|loc=''Syzygium luehmannii''}} does work, but without the warning:

Harden et al. 2014, Syzygium luehmannii

  • Harden, Gwen; McDonald, Bill; Nicholson, Nan; Tame, Terry; Williams, John (2014). "Syzygium luehmannii". Rainforest Plants of Australia: Rockhampton to Victoria. Photographs by Hugh Nicholson. Nambucca Heads, NSW: Gwen Harden Publishing. – Interactive identification key, published as USB and mobile app

So, it appears that adding |display-authors=3 to the {cite} doesn't affect the {sfn}, although having more than 3 authors in the {sfn} or {harv} etc. does. Thanks again for your help. MinorProphet ( talk) 20:22, 3 December 2021 (UTC)


  1. ^ Harden et al. 2014, Syzygium luehmannii.
{{ sfn}} and {{ harvnb}} (and the other {{ harv}} variants) have always only supported a maximum of four names when creating links to cs1|2 templates. Similarly, cs1|2 templates have always only supported four names when creating anchor IDs that {{sfn}} etc link to. Module:Footnotes is smart enough to figure out what to do with the extra name in:
{{sfn|Harden|McDonald|Nicholson|Tame|Williams|2014|loc=''Syzygium luehmannii''}} (also {{harvnb}} etc)
The Module:check for unknown parameters is an add-on to {{sfn}} to notify editors that they have written a malformed template; it has not been added to {{harvnb}}. Including more than four names serves no purpose because those extraneous names are ignored.
Trappist the monk ( talk) 22:39, 3 December 2021 (UTC)

Page is wrongly in category, can't remove

Category:Lichens described in 2009 is a subcategory of Category:Animals described in 2009, but this is wrong because lichens aren't animals. The lichens page's code has just two pieces of data: Category:Fungi described in 2009 (which is right because lichens are fungal) and {{ Category described in year}}. How can I remove the animals category? {{ Category described in year}} doesn't seem to have a way to force the appearance or non-appearance of "animals" in transcluded categories. ( talk) 07:42, 3 December 2021 (UTC)

This seems to be an issue with the Category described in year template. I would suggest asking at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Tree of Life as helpdesk advisors may not have the specialiost knowledge needed to answer this. TSventon ( talk) 07:57, 3 December 2021 (UTC)
It's not just 2009 either - Lichens appears in this category for other years as well (I only checked 2005-2008) —   Junglenut |  talk  08:04, 3 December 2021 (UTC)
It's controlled in Module:Category described in year/conf by Tom.Reding. There is currently no Lichens group and it defaults to animals. PrimeHunter ( talk) 08:26, 3 December 2021 (UTC)
Raised @ WT:WikiProject Tree of Life#Add lichens to Module:Category described in year?.   ~  Tom.Reding ( talkdgaf)  13:08, 3 December 2021 (UTC)

How do I get the Modern Skin back?

I've been using the Modern Skin since 2010 or so, maybe earlier, and accidentally changed it when changing some of my preferences; I didn't realize when I clicked Preview on another skin it actually selected it, so I Saved my changes without noticing and now Modern isn't on the list of available Skins. The Modern Skin was the easiest on my eyes, with the blue and grey, so I'd really like to know if there's some way I can get this back? Schizowallflower ( talk) 09:01, 3 December 2021 (UTC)

Already answered at the Teahouse. Please don't cross post.-- Shantavira| feed me 09:13, 3 December 2021 (UTC)

Styling my userpage

Hi, I want to change the background color of my userpage. I have created a css file, however, I don't know how to implement it properly. Can you help me? Thank you.-- John the Janitor ( talk) 11:37, 3 December 2021 (UTC)

I think you can read Help:User_style. Ruslik_ Zero 15:29, 3 December 2021 (UTC)

Surveys with Wikipedia users

Hi, I am a Ph.D. student in History and I examine how historical knowledge is produced on Wikipedia. One part of my research is to ask Wikipedia users about their experience of writing about history on Wikipedia. I sent a survey to some Wikipedia users by using the "email me" option. However, Wikipedia detects that as a bot action and an "action throttled" message appears. Could you please help me with that issue? I want just to send a survey to the members of the WikiProject United States History. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Apolo1991 ( talkcontribs) 3 December 2021 13:38 (UTC)

@ Apolo1991: Just aggressively emailing individuals asking them to participate is being correctly throttled as a spamming action. I suggest asking on the project's talk page. Anyone who sounds interested can then be individually emailed. This would keep the number low enough to avoid triggering a throttle. Nosebagbear ( talk) 18:10, 3 December 2021 (UTC)
@ Nosebagbear:Thanks for letting me know. I left a message to the WikiProject's talk page. Apolo1991 ( talk) 18:36, 3 December 2021 (UTC)

Are Wikipedia User Pages hidden from Google search?

I don't seem to be able to see them for myself or other users, and I can't find a page about it. Wakelamp d[@-@]b ( talk) 13:56, 3 December 2021 (UTC)

@ Wakelamp: From what I've seen from other user's answers, yes they are. It appears that only mainspace (article) pages are show to Google. ― Blaze The Wolf TalkBlaze Wolf#6545 14:00, 3 December 2021 (UTC)
I am happy for them to be hidden. (It's not all of wikipedia space - I can see user names on portal. Thanks for the help Wakelamp d[@-@]b ( talk) 14:09, 3 December 2021 (UTC)
On English Wikipedia, User and Draft namespaces (including User talk and Draft talk) are no-indexed, which means they don't appear on search engines. Wikipedia:Controlling search engine indexing#Other namespaces and robots.txt. This doesn't apply to other language Wikipedias, as every language does things indeoendently. Joseph 2302 ( talk) 14:12, 3 December 2021 (UTC)
@ Wakelamp: for more information on this, see WP:INDEXING. Isabelle 🔔 14:16, 3 December 2021 (UTC)
Awesome !! I couldn't find that link. Wakelamp d[@-@]b ( talk) 03:10, 4 December 2021 (UTC)

How to get started

hi, i new to contributing to ur site & were wondering if i can or allowed to contribute to makin a page for mentally obsessed the podcast bout interviews, they’ve interviewed ppl such as steve downes the voice of master chief & voice actors frm games such as resident evil, valorant, & more, im a fan & it deserves to be on ur platform, but i thought i’d ask first cus u might take it down, they have references in news sources like, metro, & express and star — Preceding unsigned comment added by Goodiegoldhammer ( talkcontribs) 15:37, 3 December 2021 (UTC)

@ Goodiegoldhammer: Hi there! Creating a new article is one of the hardest things to do on Wikipedia, especially if you have a conflict of interest (COI). To learn how to edit, you could view Help:Introduction and The Wikipedia Adventure. I suggest then spending a significant amount of time editing existing articles to hone your skills. When you're ready to create an article, you would gather independent reliable sources that have provided significant coverage of the podcast, and determine whether it meet Wikipedia's criteria for inclusion, called " notability". If so, you could declare any COI on your user page and then follow the instructions at Help:Your first article, and be prepared for a process that may include months of waiting, rejections, and rewrites, before an article is created. If you are successful, then you could never edit the article if you have a COI, but could submit edit requests on the article talk page. Hope this helps. GoingBatty ( talk) 16:14, 3 December 2021 (UTC)
Adding to what GoingBatty said, we have list of sources that's been discussed several times, WP:RSP, and if I understand you correctly, the sources you mentioned are generally considered, well, bad. Gråbergs Gråa Sång ( talk) 16:21, 3 December 2021 (UTC)
More specifically, Goodiegoldhammer, Metro is junk, the Daily Express is junk, and the Daily Star is worse than junk. The Guardian, The Observer, and (if you can tolerate its deluge of advertising) The Independent are those rarities: British alternatives that aren't junk. You might look there for sources. However, you should first take GoingBatty's excellent advice. -- Hoary ( talk) 23:44, 3 December 2021 (UTC)
If this [3] is the Metro source you were thinking of, it wouldn't help if it was in The Times, it's not independent of the subject. Gråbergs Gråa Sång ( talk) 08:49, 4 December 2021 (UTC)

Can you Please Upload the 2023 NCAA Men's Final Four Logo Please ( talk) 19:26, 3 December 2021 (UTC)

Hi there! I suggest you post your request on Talk:2023 NCAA Division I Men's Basketball Tournament, with a URL of where someone can find the logo. Happy editing! GoingBatty ( talk) 04:49, 4 December 2021 (UTC)

Thaleops taxonomy help

Hello, I’m Ian creating a page of the Illaenid Trilobite Thaleops, however I am having a problem where it says I am missing taxonomic templates, if anyone can go in their and see what’s wrong would be awesome, thanks

Fossiladder13 — Preceding unsigned comment added by Fossiladder13 ( talkcontribs) 21:07, 3 December 2021 (UTC)

This question is too specialised for me, and maybe for many of those who answer questions here. You could ask at at Wikipedia:WikiProject_Arthropods.   Maproom ( talk) 22:34, 3 December 2021 (UTC)

Wikipedia talk:Did you know/Supplementary guidelines

Can anyone see what I'm doing wrong with the archiving here? I added an archives, then tried to archive the first section to test it. It failed twice. —valereee ( talk) 21:08, 3 December 2021 (UTC)


I've received a notification of a welcome message at what I understand is Fiji Hindi Wikipedia. I'm unaware of ever having contributed there (indeed I was unaware of its existence), and have no listed contributions there. Is everyone getting these, or is it just me? I'm not complaining, I'm happy to accept "Namaste" from a random stranger; I'm just puzzled. Maproom ( talk) 22:54, 3 December 2021 (UTC)

Firstly, Namaste to you Maproom. I visited the Fiji Hindi Wikipedia using your link and I immediately received the namaste welcome message. So, I suspect that whoever has configured that Wikipedia's welcome messages has configured it in a way that one receives the message upon visiting that Wikipedia in a logged-in mode. Usually I have seen other language Wikipedia projects configure it to send a message based on an user's first logged-in edit (not a visit). PS: I also did not know that the Fijian Hindi wikipedia did not use the Devanagiri script. Was surprised to see it use English-Latin sript. Filing this under 'Today I learnt' section of my mind. Ktin ( talk) 23:19, 3 December 2021 (UTC)
The logs say your account was created the same minute as the welcome. [4] [5] According to seconds, it was created one second before. Account creations at other wikis usually happen because you visit any page while logged in. They can also happen if a page you edited at another wiki is imported but there are no imports since April. [6] PrimeHunter ( talk) 02:18, 4 December 2021 (UTC)

How to collapse a template that will not respond to the state=collapsed parameter

The template

is included at the bottom of the IBM 5100 page. The template is currently being displayed as Open (on the page) and I would like to collapse it. Normally I would do this by simply adding the parameter state=collapsed to the template but when I do this to this template on the IBM 5100 page the template remains open. How would I close this template on this page? FFM784 ( talk) 23:39, 3 December 2021 (UTC)

@ FFM784: It requires that a state parameter is implemented in the template. I have done it. [7] PrimeHunter ( talk) 01:55, 4 December 2021 (UTC)
@ PrimeHunter: Thank you. FFM784 ( talk) 02:39, 4 December 2021 (UTC)

Donations (a different thread)

I would love to donate Bitcoin to Wikipedia, and I'm sure if we advertise that option on twitter there will be others that will send some as well. It might not be much but every little bit can help. If anyone wants more information on how to accomplish adding this feature please don't hesitate to contact me. I am not a programmer but I am familiar with most options to accept/store/covert bitcoin. It can be saved or instantly converted to dollars. Thanks for all of your contributions!! — Preceding unsigned comment added by ( talk) 23:56, 3 December 2021 (UTC)

Thank you for your offer, but I'm pretty sure that there's enough knowledge about how to handle (and how/why not to handle) the various rival e-moneys. If you have something specific in mind, you could suggest it to the WMF rather than to just a single Wikipedia. -- Hoary ( talk) 00:11, 4 December 2021 (UTC)
Added "(a different thread)" to the title, for technical reasons. -- Hoary ( talk) 00:12, 4 December 2021 (UTC)
See donate:Ways to Give#Cryptocurrency. PrimeHunter ( talk) 01:42, 4 December 2021 (UTC)

chicxulub crater

Hello, I do not know if this will be added to the chicxulub crater page but in 1977 I was in my Geology class in high school and I hypothesized that a meteor hit the area now associated with Chicxulub crater. Needless to say, I was laughed out of class saying that if that was true then science would already have known that. What i am saying is that the first one to hypothesized that a meteor hit the peninsula was me. Now I do not have any proof of that because we did not have iphones or pagers or anything like that and I do not have any of my high school notes, nor do I remember my Geology teachers name but I was in Mesquite High School, 10th grade. Thank you — Preceding unsigned comment added by Rickp99 ( talkcontribs) 01:25, 4 December 2021 (UTC)

Wikipedia summarizes what independent reliable sources say, so unless one documents your claim, sorry, it can't be on Wikipedia. 331dot ( talk) 01:34, 4 December 2021 (UTC)
Hi, Rickp99. Evidence of the presence of the impact crater, buried 20km deep under overlying sedimentary deposits, was supposedly first suspecteded by petroleum-industry geologists using advanced (and commercially secret) magnetic and gravitic survey data in 1978, and confirmatory evidence was only found in 1990. Apart from a then-obscure pattern of cenotes in the jungle of the Yucatan peninsula, I'm unaware of any previously-known surface details that might have suggested a crater there, or any other reason to think there had been an impact. Can you give us some details about what might have led a high-school student (presumably in Arizona or Texas) in 1977 to come to such a hypothesis? {The poster formerly known as} ( talk) 08:58, 4 December 2021 (UTC)

Donation request.

I have donated and have an ongoing donation but I still get messages asking me to donate. Is there a problem with your software recognising this — Preceding unsigned comment added by ( talk) 04:34, 4 December 2021 (UTC)

Hi there! If you create an account, you will then have the option to turn off the fundraising banners. Without an account, the Wikipedia software can't associate your IP address with your donations. Hope this helps! GoingBatty ( talk) 04:55, 4 December 2021 (UTC)
Please also read Wikimedia_Foundation#Finances.-- Shantavira| feed me 09:16, 4 December 2021 (UTC)
Donation records are not tied to accounts; those records are held by the Foundation. As you use an IP address, the software has no way of knowing if the person sitting at the computer at any given moment has seen a donation request. 331dot ( talk) 09:58, 4 December 2021 (UTC)

Makoto Soejima

So I accidently submitted this in mainspace before it was ready. I moved it back to draft space to finish. Now it is waiting AFC review since its BLP. I'm not sure why people think this was a rejected article when the history trail shows my name as the one who moved it. Was I supposed to tag/untag something here?

- Imcdc ( talk) 04:56, 4 December 2021 (UTC)

Hello — Preceding unsigned comment added by DominicReymysterio619 ( talkcontribs) 06:36, 4 December 2021 (UTC)